Dogville named as the Norwegian murderer Breivik's favorite film

http://blogs.indiewire.com/thompsononhollywood/2011/07/30/von_trier_talks_dogville_influence_on_norway_massacre/
What do people think of this? Even Trier admits the similarity between the massacre and the end of Dogville although it does seem like the list was chosen for content rather than this guy actually enjoying the films. How could someone love Dogville and also 300? And then the Gladiator pick as well.
Im assuming (if he actually was the one to create this facebook page)he like the anti-Islam of 300, the underdog fighting the evil empire in Gladiator, and then Dogville may have been chosen solely for the ending.

“How could someone love Dogville and also 300?”

Not to be flip: he’s insane. That’s as far as I think one can get relying on logic when evaluating this situation.

John David Chapman obessed over Catcher in the Rye, John Hinkley over Taxi Driver. Charles Manson liked the Beatles and the Beach Boys. A lot of Nazi officers were very interested in the fine arts. Great art doesn’t necessarily make you a better (or saner) person.

I think he likes the idea of draconic response to moral flaws.

@Jirin I agree. But it’s interesting because Lars made the ending so that it wasn’t like the typical catharsis people get from revenge films,there was some moral dilemma. Maybe this just made it realistic?
@Ben Simington Multiple people have said he s perfectly sane, so the typical thing we say about serial killers doesn’t apply as well. Also it’s had man political dimensions,
I consider Anders was trying to emulate Max Manus in a major way,as Max also protected his country from foreign invaders when much of the political elite was corrupted. Only time will tell how much of modern Europe’s immigration policy was based on greed without regard for the impact on the average,non-rich European.

I think von Trier is ecstatic to hear it

Also here is Lars trying to point the finger at Denmarks anti-immigrant group.http://onlyindenmark.wordpress.com/tag/lars-von-trier/ I find this pretty nasty,he shouldve explained why Dogville doesn’t support the killing of inferior people with clarity rather than blame a group that is simply reacting to poor immigration policy,made with the goal of getting cheap labor into the country,and then hidden under a veil of righteous anti racism and “tolerance”. I despise the word tolerance, it means basically we need to learn to accept something that is noxious. On one hand the we are told to tolerate gays and on the other to tolerate Muslims(Shariah demands the killing of homosexuals).
I think it’s weak that Lars tries to deflect blame onto the local anti immigration party.

Maybe this will prompt von Trier to make the third movie in the proposed trilogy!

“I think it’s weak that Lars tries to deflect blame onto the local anti immigration party.”

So you think the film should be blamed for Breivik’s actions???

I’m surprisingly impressed by how sensitive and reasonable Von Trier’s reply was. A reminder that although he acts like a jackass at times, he can be quite decent when he wants to be.

“Multiple people have said he s perfectly sane”
I guess I would find it hard to agree with those folks.

not that i like quoting Scream, but a line in that film always stuck with, and it went something like ‘Movies don’t create psychos. Movies make psychos more creative!’ and the same applies to the other art forms.

Once people snap, they snap. i guess the chance that someone could become that influenced by them to that degree is possible, but i doubt in most instances that is truly the case.

i just wish that when people truly go on a rampage, they destroy anything that could be linked or blamed for their outburst.

if any of you decide to on a killing spree in near future, make sure you burn all your heavy metal cd’s, horror dvd’s etc well in advance and fill up my cd shelves with useless pop. i’ll wear a Rhianna or Justin Bieber shirt on the day of the massacre too ;-)

get rid of those art films too. film the shelves with blockbusters only.

Can this thread be far off:
TOP TEN FAVS OF SERIAL KILLERS AND MURDERERS

I considered Dogville as a film against bigotry and intolerance towards immigrants/foreigners/people who are different, and also against religious hypocrisy- linked with the fiundamentalist Right in the US. This rightwing nutter may have liked the violence of the ending but missed the point of what was being attacked. In Dogville the failings of so-called liberals were also clear to see- maybe the nutter got off on that. For nutter he is- just cos countless millions of people may share his dangerous delusions does not make him any less deluded and sick. Reactionary rightwing bigots are to me sick in the head, much more so than many who get banged up with mental health problems. Societies are often far more sick than individuals considered mentally ill.

What was the purpose of publicising his favourite film? There are deranged rightwing nutters in the US who love Brazil, but that could be read from a very different political angle.

I agree with Kenji regarding what Dogville is about. Part of what makes that film so remarkable is that it makes us long so strongly for Grace to get revenge, but when she finally does get revenge it’s so shocking, frank and brutal that it makes us wonder why we could have ever wanted her to get revenge. It’s the ultimate statement against revenge because instead of lecturing us it understands that to leave the biggest impact on us it must first make us long for the revenge to occur: shattering our beliefs leaves a deeper mark than simply reaffirming our beliefs.

“I think von Trier is ecstatic to hear it”

Even if you don’t like von Trier’s films he still does NOT deserve to be insulted like that. Why the hell do you think he could possibly be ecstatic to hear about this?

In Dogville though, I think the ending says “Grace shouldn’t have been as forgiving of their flaws at the beginning when they were still being relatively kind to her”, and that it’s arrogant to preach that tolerance. The film is easily viewed as anti-liberal, Grace’s arrogant tolerance being the liberal vice, and the citizens of Dogville (To the mind of a bigot) easily compared to whatever group of unwelcome outsiders they target. They started treating her like a prisoner-slave because she was tolerant. She gave an inch of kindness and they realized they could take whatever they wanted from her. To the mind of a hateful person, that’s going to say ‘If we let those people in and forgive their differences, they’ll exploit our kindness!’

The thing about Grace’s revenge though is that she didn’t just kill the people who raped and shackled her, she killed all the people who were just conforming to it, and the children who were just emulating their parents and couldn’t have known any better.

You can’t trivialise this and blame everything on Von Trier. Breivik has watched Dogville and applied his own meaning and everybody else can also do this.

Trier has reasons to point the finger elsewhere. If you read his manifesto it’s clear he has a catologue of fairly mainstream sources from Hobbes to Far Eastern cultures. Reducing the Danish Peoples Party to simply anti-immigration is a misjudgement, it is more than that, for example, Søren Krarup compared the wearing of burkas and niqabs to the Swastika and communist hammer and sickle. So, it’s not so much for me to do with tolerance of as it is to do with freedom of religion.

DISCUSS.

Maud’s Son above:
I find this pretty nasty,he shouldve explained why Dogville doesn’t support the killing of inferior people with clarity rather than blame a group that is simply reacting to poor immigration policy,made with the goal of getting cheap labor into the country,and then hidden under a veil of righteous anti racism and “tolerance”. I despise the word tolerance, it means basically we need to learn to accept something that is noxious. On one hand the we are told to tolerate gays and on the other to tolerate Muslims(Shariah demands the killing of homosexuals).

Am I the only one that finds the above post and the tone of the OP and thread totally offensive? I am disgusted about the amount of trolling allowed to take place on these boards. If this represents the continuing lowering tone of this forum, I for one, am out of here.

I request this thread be closed.

@BOB THE OBSCURE sorry I plagiarized the part of that the idea of tolerance being a crappy concept-it isn’t meant to be right wing- this is a quote by someone who I can’t  remember the name of about how we set ourselves up for failure by the idea that we need to tolerate other cultures or lifestyles.
I worded it wrong,I’m not saying gays are noxious. The idea that we need to tolerate gays to me is the problem with the whole concept-it sort of assumes that gays a group that to be around is just one more annoynace that we have to deal with in our daily lives.
It wasn’t meant to be a trolling attempt or even a  right wing  comment-although I think one should be able to disagree with the typical liberal belief system on here. While said I was against Europe’s immigration policies, this wasn’t meant in a racist fashion.  
Also I  think Von Trier’s blaming the group criticizing immigration in Denmark sucks- he literally calls for them to apologize for Breviek’s crime, which is absurd,right? To me, this is a cheap shot by Trier.

The whole post:’s point: I was trying to share something I found randomly,I thought it was interesting how the press wanted to blame 300 and Gladiator(these are the 2 the MSM has talked about) but then it ignored Dogville, which when I rewatched the ending speech i could see why Trier has a though time defending his film.

I like this site because it’s not IMDB so I apologize if it seemed like trolling- I hope there can be a major forum like this about movies without being trooped to death.

Sorry that trolled to death

Anders Behring also loves crappy techno music.

DISCUSS.

Yeah, mostly contemptible musical preferences, It is not so much techno either, I have sufficient doubt he could have told you anything about techno music, it was Clint Mansell’s Lux Aeterna, very basic movement in G Minor, that invoked war in him. it should also give you some sort clues, if at all needed, towards his character; it’s easy to see he has not travelled on foot much.

I suggest the internet age probably played some part towards fueling his imagination, he must have read something somewhere that tipped him over the edge, a conviction that the world needed his presence.

This is another example of Helter Skelter syndrome. Art/Artists that in anyway challenge societal convention seem to be on the front line of attack in such cases. Most people find it easier to lay blame here rather than looking at the societal ills (bullying, child abuse, untreated mental illness. people ignoring the signs) that are really at the root of such things. Of course, even the best societies can not address and/or prevent every issue but an honest look at where society fails after such events may help. Emphasis on the word ‘honest’ here.

Dogville is one of my favorite films. I have never been under the impression that Von Trier was in anyway advocating violence but merely examining and dissecting what leads to such acts just as Pasolini examined man’s inhumanity to his fellow man in Salo, I would hate to think what a person suffering from psychosis might be capable of if Antichrist were his/her favorite film.

Maud’s Son – It wasn’t meant to be a trolling attempt or even a right wing commnet

I have a similar pm from Maud’s Son re this. However, I hope you can see my own problems with the tone of the quote in my post. I will take it from your explanation that you are sincere, so I withdraw the trolling comment and my comment re closing the thread. If I somehow misinterpreted your remarks or the point you were making, I apologize. I just think on a personal level that trying to make any point re this brutal and senseless act by Breivik. or whatever his tastes in films, could be seen as being in poor taste. As Breivik’s own actions and thoughts have a distinctly racist component, we need to be sensitive to this. I will say no more on the subject on this thread.

Nonsense.