I find it interesting that you find absolutely nothing in Treadwell; to simply write him off as a nut job is to fail to find the profound insight present in this masterpiece. Clearly, Herzog does not condone the man’s actions, nor even like him, but as he states in the film there is meaning to Treadwell’s life and death. Also, just as interesting as the primary subject of Grizzly Man are the parallels between Treadwell and Herzog. Not that they are similar in personality, but perhaps in method. This film really amazes me, as it provides the story of Timothy Treadwell, the subtext of Werner Herzog, and an amazing metaphor for our mysterious relationship with nature as a whole.
I like your second point, though obviously I disagree with your first. I need to know more about Herzog.
I’m not saying you have to like the guy, but his story is a complex one, not a simple case of a “true nut-job”. His misplaced love and faith is fascinating. In fact I forgot to mention another layer of the film which involves the similarity between Treadwell’s relationship with bears and the relationship many have with God.
Oh, no doubt Treadwell is a complex and fascinating nut-job, but a nut-job nonetheless.
Haha. Fair enough. I just think it’s best to examine and understand his mistakes and flaws (and doing so seems to add an, albeit minor, level of endearing quality to the man)
I understand that, but any feeling of endearment or sympathy ends violently for me with his girlfriend dying a horrible death because of his mistakes and flaws.
FTW: Treadwell’s relationship with bears and the relationship many have with God.
he had faith, didn’t he?
Oh if only the producers of Cheers hadn’t picked Woody Harrelson.
His girlfriend took a risk and she paid for it with her life. How many people die every year riding in cars with drunk drivers? The driver is guilty but the passengers are just as responsible for their own lives and participation. I mean these are people LICENSED to operate these machines, SURELY they must know what they’re doing?
All I saw in the film was a man coping with severe alcoholic depression. He obviously didn’t get the help he needed so he turned to a distracting addiction…that just happened to be playing with 1000 lbs bears. Based on some of the things he said I wouldn’t be surprised if he was also a closet homosexual which caused further grief in his life. He was a troubled man, there was no moral or genius there.
The difference between a Treadwell and an Irwin is night and day.
And for what it’s worth being buried alive is probably much more unpleasant than being eaten by a bear. But at that point we’re talking inches of difference not miles.
@Joshua
Hahaha. Who knows what life he may have lead?
Hahaha, just came to read this one. I agree with you Josh. It’s so unfortunate that Treadwell’s girlfriend died, but I suppose she knew the potential risks before she became involved and went with him. :(
I share a great deal of the thoughts and feelings in Josh’s original post. I read a lengthy Vanity Fair piece about this idiot a few years ago, and he ticked me off so much I don’t think I’ll ever be able to watch Herzog’s movie, despite being a Herzog fan. I understand why Herzog made it; Treadwell is right up his alley in many ways, but I’m probably going to have to pass on it.
I have watched small segments of Treadwell’s home videos, and read other reviews of Herzog’s film. I personally don’t think Treadwell was a “nut job” per se – I might have been able to pity him if I thought he were really mentally ill. From my reading, I’m more of the opinion that he was simply a completely self-absorbed, self-centered and childish person. Utterly immature, lacking in common sense, and too self-indulgent to listen even to local professionals who truly do love the bears. Bah.
I share a great deal of the thoughts and feelings in Josh’s original post. I read a lengthy Vanity Fair piece about this idiot a few years ago, and he ticked me off so much I don’t think I’ll ever be able to watch Herzog’s movie, despite being a Herzog fan. I understand why Herzog made it; Treadwell is right up his alley in many ways, but I’m probably going to have to pass on it.
I have watched small segments of Treadwell’s home videos, and read other reviews of Herzog’s film. I personally don’t think Treadwell was a “nut job” per se – I might have been able to pity him if I thought he were really mentally ill. From my reading, I’m more of the opinion that he was simply a completely self-absorbed, self-centered and childish person. Utterly immature, lacking in common sense, and too self-indulgent to listen even to local professionals who truly do love the bears.
Bah.
Michelle: “I’m more of the opinion that he was simply a completely self-absorbed, self-centered and childish person. Utterly immature, lacking in common sense, and too self-indulgent to listen even to local professionals who truly do love the bears.”
This is actually what I really mean by, “nut-job”. Thank you for so eloquently agreeing with me ;)
I think he was eating some of the wild mushrooms growing around Alaska. He was crazy and a little too much into himself, but nonetheless, I value his love for the bears.
His “love for the bears” got one killed. The man was morally reprehensible and a danger to himself and others.
How come there’s so many of these threads? It’s not a bad thing, at least the stupid ones got pushed to the second page, but I just don’t understand why there are so many at once. :(
could anyone enlighten me?
No idea why. I already said once in another thread that it would be much more effective and welcomed with a subforum. At present it’s just a flood of short reviews with 10 comments that disappear off the front page in minutes.
Timothy Treadwell was certainly a frustrated, self-absorbed, and emotionally unstable person. But I don’t think that herzog’s intent was for the viewers to just dismiss Treadwell—as someone has already pointed out, Treadwell has many parallels to Herzog himself. And I’d also point out that Treadwell has many parallels to Herzog’s protagonists.
Treadwell was someone, in his misguided self-aggrandizement, foolishly believed that he could somehow overcome the forces of nature with his will. This tendency is one that is found in Herzog’s characters like Fitzcarraldo and Aguirre, who both wage unwinnable fights against nature. And of course, Herzog has this tendency himself. I don’t think that Herzog wants us to admire this particular trait in himself and his characters, but he is at least giving a grudging nod of acceptance to this overwhelming drive that exists within certain human beings.
It’s a drive that is at simultaneously incredibly foolhardy and possibly (rarely, yet still possibly) transcendent. Of course, this drive can be described as a type of madness. And Treadwell definitely fell mostly on the side of madness rather than an inspired drive, but I think Herzog wants us to examine this impulse within ourselves. It’s an impulse that can lead either to self-destruction or transcendence. One may or may not like Herzog as a director, but there is no doubt that he is someone who has effectively sublimated this impulse/drive/madness into a life of creative energy. On the other hand, it drove Treadwell to self-destruction. But they’re flip sides of the same coin, and it’s this duality that we need to think about.
Very well put, Blue K. I find this film endlessly rich.
Best scene in the film: As Treadwell’s footage shows a fight between two bears, one shits itself as they wrestle.
I loved Grizzly Man, whether Treadwell was a fool or simple or had misplaced trust is beside the fact. Treadwell cared for nature and wanted to be a part of it and care for it. The road to Hell as they say is paved with good intentions. Still he wanted to educate others on nature and bears. It’s hard to fault him for being passionate. He lived what he loved. You really can’t take that away. I think that Herzog’s film painted a loving portrait of a loving, caring albeit misguided man.
I would say Herzog created a morbidly fascinating portrait, but not loving.
I’m a little surprised at the hostility towards Treadwell in some of the comments. I can understand the anger, to some degree, because Treadwell’s girlfriend died….I was going to say “as a result of Treadwell’s actions,” but that’s not entirely true, is it? I mean, she knew what he was doing and had to be aware of the dangers. (I think the film talked about her fear and reservations of going out in the wild.)
Blue makes some valid and interesting points about the Treadwell—although I don’t know if Treadwell was about overcoming nature so much as being a part of it. In a way that was dangerous and misguided, too, because it wasn’t accurate. Still, the reasons he tries to become a part of nature made me sympathize with him. He clearly struggled to fit into human society, and I found the remarks about this from Treadwell’s filmic journal entries to be sad. At the same time, there is something beautiful about the way he finds his place in nature—not just with the bears, but all the animals in the wild. His expressions of gratitude (sometimes literally thanking the animals for being his friend) and genuine joy and wonder were really touching and inspiring to see. (Yet, there is that dark side waiting, literally, in the bushes.) I can’t just dismiss these feelings from him; I can relate to not being fully accepted and the difficulty of fitting in—perhaps not to the extent that he did. Nevertheless, if one can’t find a place to fit in, and finally finds a place where one can—even a dangerous one—does that make someone an “Idiot” or a “nut-job?” Well, I don’t think so—or at least these characterizations are somewhat unfair and a bit dismissive.
In any event, I thought he was fascinating character—not just for his eccentricities, but for his humanity.
I honestly don’t think there was anymore to this film than a simple cautionary message. Blue K’s analysis was absolutely spot on, but to me this film was another one of Herzog’s films about the hostility of nature, and man’s futile attempts to conquer it. I think that, in this new age time we live in, people equate the natural with the good all too readily, and this film acts as an effective counterbalance to the neo-hippie mentality that is prevalent in society today that nature is our friend.
The man died doing something he loved, and I don’t think there’s anything shameful about that. Nor do I think that he was trying to “overcome” nature. To live as one and die as one is not overcoming, but recognizing the natural law, welcoming and embracing its uncertainty, and being at peace with that, without being inhibited by fear.
Who are we to judge another man’s happiness, or dictate how he should live his life? What’re we all supposed to work on Wall Street? Perhaps you could argue that he was deluded, but aren’t we all, especially those who live-in and provide for such a Faustian society (come on, we’re all guilty of this)? Couldn’t you say that our entire system is trying to “overcome” the forces of nature?
I don’t intend to start an argument, nor do I think that anyone’s opinion is the absolute, because I don’t think that there is a right or wrong in this discussion.
:Treadwell’s girlfriend died too.
I’m aware.
House of Leaves
This film could have been subtitled: How to get eaten by a bear.
Timothy Treadwell’s legacy will be that he instructed the world exactly how NOT to behave around one of nature’s most powerful and deadly creatures. That the result of viewing Werner Herzog’s documentary is to firmly believe that Treadwell got what he deserved (and is 100% responsible for his girlfriend’s death) is not due to anything attributable to Herzog. If I had simply seen Treadwell’s video diaries (to call them a film-in-development would be like calling the video of my daughter’s third birthday the same) without any commentary, I would still have the same opinion. Treadwell was a deeply disturbed individual, highly unstable emotionally, and had absolutely no business doing what he was doing.
Truthfully, he was lucky he lived as long as he did. The only real tragedy in all this, aside from the fact that the bear that ate him was killed, is that there was a sad enough individual to call herself his girlfriend and actually follow him around out there. She died being eaten alive. Can you think of anything worse? This poor woman, finding herself lonely enough to feel somewhat fulfilled by this guy, finds herself an eyewitness to the bear that finally had enough, and ate him as he screamed in agony. According to people who have heard the audio tape of the incident, she never ran away. She continued to stand by the tent where the attack occurred, screaming and screaming in a manner suggestive of the fact that her mind had simply abandoned her, until the bleating cries lured the bear back, and she became its final victim.
I stress how she died in order to fully explain my purpose for writing this review. We’re not talking about an accident. This isn’t two mountaineers who went snowshoeing and got caught in an avalanche. This is one utterly irresponsible, socially retarded, self-deluded, child of a man and an inexperienced and frightened woman, neither of them armed in the least.
In sum, I feel no sympathy for this guy because, as he stated, he died the way he wanted to die, on his terms. He states this during the film, but continually contradicts it saying that these bears would never hurt him. His is a fascinating study of a true nut-job, someone so completely divorced from reality that they actually end up causing two unnecessary deaths.
“*Auteurs Page*”:http://www.theauteurs.com/films/2267