Seriously, calling something overrated implies that just because you dislike something means everyone else must feel the same way. This is a selfish claim in my opinion. Would it not suffice to simply say that it did not appeal to you but that you respect the opinions of others, concerning a certain work of art.
I only respect the opinions of others who agree with me. The rest of them are wrong.
This thread is overrated.
Seriously. First Taran—- well you know who, he who must not be named and now Overrated… at this rate we’ll have no forum in no time.
The great thing about the internet is that you’re entitled to your opinion—no matter how wrong it may be. ;]
Instead of evicting words from discussions why don’t we just back them up with explanatory…words, and then refrain from questioning the meaning of each and every explanatory word and just try to understand what the person is saying. You know, something like what you have in a forum.
I agree with Mike, and I would add something else. When people use terms like “overrated” or “pretentious,” why not offer a thoughtful rebuttal if you disagree? Wouldn’t that be a simple way to deal with the issue? Now, if the person using those terms is being a jerk, then I can see people getting annoyed by that. Still, even in those cases, a thoughtful rebuttal wouldn’t hurt.
Generally, I don’t mind when people start threads like that—especially those that do so because they’re genuinely interested in hearing opposing arguments. Indeed, I actually relish responding to threads that call films/filmmakers that I love “overrated.” As long as the OP is open and willing to respond in a thoughtful way, I think these can be the most interesting and enjoyable discussions.
Just my two cents on the matter.
To Be or Not To Be: “If it wasn’t for Jews, fags, and gypsies, there would be no theater!”
Jeez, soon there’ll be no forum!
THANK YOU, MIKE!!!
Well intentioned or not, any calls to “ban” certain words are ALWAYS misguided. I once made a pretty big ass out of myself when I got into an argument over my using of the word “sophomoric” in reference to Von Trier’s Antichrist. But I still stand by my point about being able to use whatever word you wish to describe your feelings about a film. The following is just a very small sample of modifiers that we all use to describe a film. And they are in essence all value judgments.
overrated; pretentious; sophomoric; great; bad; crappy; shitty; egregious; good; horrible; poignant; uplifting; incisive; insightful; overreaching; contrived; cruddy; stupid; brilliant; retarded; horrific; awesome; amazing; incredible; unbelievable; inert; vibrant; life-affirming; depressing; caustic; cynical; ironic; humorous; comical; laughable; sad; pathetic; insufferable; unbearable…
This kind of thread and argument reminds me of the late great George Carlin.
Add my name to the list of those who don’t mind any adjective being used as long as it is backed up by some sort of explanation beyond “I hate it. It sucked. People who like that film are idiots.” Such juvenile assertions serve no purpose other than to antagonize and are appropriate only for gradeschool playgrounds, not amongst discussions by intelligent adults.
And by the way, there’s a nifty rate the movie function people can use if they have nothing to say about a film other than they don’t like it. Go on, give it a one star rating and let people know what you think, but leave the discussion board for, you know, actual discussions.
Hey Queens, how about you put an extra couple minutes of thought into your threads before posting. The only thing worse than yet another “overrated” post is an “overrated is overrated” post. And besides, “evict” the word? Was it paying you rent at some point?
Let’s don’t and say we did.
Seriously, calling something overrated implies that just because you dislike something means everyone else must feel the same way. This is a selfish claim in my opinion.
Seriously, calling for a banning of use of certain words implies that just because you dislike some words means everyone else must feel the same way. This is a selfish claim in my opinion.
What is worse than someone using a word that you don’t like is thinking that you somehow have the authority to curb the usage of that word. This idea that you somehow have an authority on HOW someone is to describe their evaluation of certain films is what is supremely self-important. See, in the arts community, there is this concept called CENSORSHIP which is generally frowned upon. if you disagree with WHAT someone says about a film, then engage that person in a thoughtful debate. if you find it so annoying, you can just choose to ignore it. Telling others that they are to express themselves only in ways that you approve of is UNACCEPTABLE in a free society.
-Seriously, calling for a banning of use of certain words-
OK—surely we’re not all that literal minded. Obviously the original post is not calling for the word to literally be banned. It’s asking for everyone to stop dropping cliches like “overrated” like they actually mean something. Obviously we can’t legislate it away, but does anyone disagree that we could do with a little less cliche, monosyllabic grunting and threadbare hyperbole in our filmtalk?
It’s asking for everyone to stop dropping cliches like “overrated” like they actually mean something.
But Matt, the word “overrated” DOES actually mean something. Yeah, it’s overused, misused, and you may really hate having to read it. But, so what??? It’s not as if the word is something that can’t ever be used appropriately in a proper context. That’s why the word exists. Why do people try to tell others what and how to write? Tyranny of thought, anyone?
All word meanings are relatively unstable in that they rely on other words in order to maintain that meaning. The word “is” actually means something, too. Does that make “The Red Shoes is” a reasonable or even coherent opinion? It’s a complete, grammatically correct sentence, after all. It’s even factually true. “The Red Shoes is overrated” is slightly better, but it still says virtually nothing about the film, and literally nothing about who exactly is doing the alleged rating, why they got it wrong, etc.. Yet it’s dropped into threads here as though it were some grand critical pronouncement. It isn’t. It’s trite. The last thing I gonna do is tell someone how to write, but as best I can tell, most everyone who posts here is capable of better communicating their idead about this stuff.
You know, I agree with much of what you’re saying. Use of word like “overrated” is often a sin of intellectual laziness and arrogance. But what I’m saying is that curbing the use of the word as the OP suggested is also a sin of intellectual laziness at the very least. And probably one of arrogance as well. And it becomes a slippery rope. Because the point you made, The Red Shoes is overrated is slightly better, but it still says virtually nothing about the film can also be said about “The Red Shoes is magnificent” or “The Red Shoes is the best film” or whatever.
Yes. The only distinction I would make between “The Red Shoes is magnificent” or “The Red Shoes is the best film” and “overrated” is that, although no more without meaning, “overrated” is more of a cliche, particularly in regard to discussion of film. Of course it has its place, but it would probably lead to better discussions if everyone were a little more precise in their word choices . . . or at least were willing to throw me a bone and go the thesaurus once in awhile . . .
assess too highly, build up, exaggerate, exceed, expect too much of, magnify, make too much of, overassess, overesteem, overestimate, overpraise, overprize, overreckon, oversell, overvalue, rate too highly, think too highly of, think too much of
Matt said, “Obviously we can’t legislate it away, but does anyone disagree that we could do with a little less cliche, monosyllabic grunting and threadbare hyperbole in our filmtalk?”
Yes, I agree with you, Matt. (that is, I agree we could use less cliche, etc.) Honestly, that’s not how I read the OP—i.e. I thought the OP called for stopping the use of those words. Maybe I took it the wrong way. I do agree we need more thoughtful discourse and less monsyllabic responses. However, we must remember this is a bulletin board on the internet. Unfortunately, the medium is not conducive to long, thougthful posts. That doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep trying (because I still do), but I do think we have to realize that those type of thoughtful posts are difficult to write. If we only posted when we could write long explanations and well-argued defenses of our positions, the activity level would diminish significantly. Maybe that would be a good thing, but I tend to think not. Besides, sometimes the thought of writing a thoughtful response deters from posting something. I don’t think that’s such a good thing, either.
we must remember this is a bulletin board on the internet.—-
Point taken. I’m actually fine with periodically posting thing that are more or less throwaways, and use them myself as much as anyone I’m sure. I would just like to see rely on “overrated” and the like a little less.
I’m confused with your position Blue – your terribly awesome thread seems to contradict what you’re saying in here. I need to go lie down.