“It’s about destroying stereotypes, it’s about casting actors to be on an equal plane. Jamie Foxx shouldn’t be the first to die in Stealth”
LL Cool J lived in Deep Blue Sea :P
and not to pick against you Glemaud but don’t you find it rather discriminatory when many people speak of something Asian and 90% of the times they mostly refer to the Eastern Asians?i mean….aren’t the Western Asians parts of Asia the continent too?
that’s a very common phenomenon inside the film business,i have observed many a-times even from people i know who want to say Asian cinema and what they mean is simply Japanese cinema..which is quite pathetic if you want my view on that..
The shark found LL too sexy to eat. I mean, c’mon, I’d eat Samuel L. Jackson over LL any day.
I do agree with you on that Dim, but that’s something that’s so entrenched into today’s society that I don’t think it will ever change. It’s kind of like Africa and Egypt. Many don’t see Egyptians as being Africans for some odd reason. They know it’s located on the continent, but can’t come to call them Africans. Calling a Russian person an Asian would go against what society has built, so it just doesn’t compute in their brain.
I try and catch myself, but I too am guilty of such statements. I say Asian, when I really mean those in the Eastern area. In my quest of worldly knowledge, I’ve become less susceptible to making these statements, but even I can slip up, no?
sure thing,however….if we let these statements progress,it’s another reason why availability and lesser know countries will never get the high recognition they deserve and will be called with these exclamations…
when i notice in multiple pointless threads films either being watched twice or films mostly criticized for being of a minimum budget compared to the luxuries of Western societies,it kinda pisses me off…..and it’s usually the films that people MUST see regardless of how many from the public expressed their resent/appreciation….
for instance,thanks to the Cup i managed to watch 2 amazing revelations like Minh and Mambety,2 individuals that not even a huge majority of critics doesn’t wish to see and yet people still think that Il Postino and Lives of Others are the “trends” of “foreign” language films,meaning the ones that aren’t a U.S. product,since we’re dealing with (unfortunately) 2 different cinematic lands as it is by now (and i have been accused by many of plagiarism here but i cannot see where i’m wrong)
so racism in film becomes a racism towards the “unknown lands” of film industry sometimes,and i feel it can be applied to the topic we’re discussing…it’s funny come to think of it when most people express a certain admiration for Atonement and yet,they would never even consider watching or accepting the fact that yes,in 2007 the cinematic map has many neglected countries that overscale the english language border but all that remains is Counterfeiters and what a popular U.S. commercialism wants to promote..
and that is a most urgent reason for all of us to avoid the typical comment of Asian cinema being only Chinese and Japanese and of European cinema being only Western countries etc etc…
@ Glemaud ‘It’s not being racist when equality is wanted. Let’s look at the best actor award for this century. We have Forest Whitaker (The Last King of Scotland), Jamie Foxx (Ray) and Denzel Washington (Training Day). They are all playing black people. Now, my argument is this: why can’t they play just a regular person? Why does Denzel have to be the over the top black guy, who gets stopped by the white man (Ethan Hawke)?’
Dear Glemaud, excuse my ignorance but surely the actors you cite have to play roles that depict “black people” as they themselves are black … whether the performances are over the top or not is not the point, what you seem to be implying (worryingly at best, racist at worst) is that black does not equal “regular”. Also surely DW in his role for Training Day is reprising a type of performance that is echoed in the likes of Die Hard, True Lies, Rocky etc, are these performances unproblematic (following your argument) due to the ethnicity and skin colour of the lead actors then?
@Glemaud,
Did you watch Rachel Getting Married? We had a huge flap here several days ago over that film, lol, but anyway, one of the most refreshing things about that film was the race-neutral casting of some of the more significant minor roles. For example, the husband of Rachel—the titular bride and the sister of the female protagonist—was played by a black actor. The role was written as a race-neutral one and filled by a black actor. And accordingly, much of the rest of the cast were multiracial as now you had an interracial couple whose friends and families were necessarily of different ethnicities. But the interracial nature of the relationship was never alluded to. It was really one of the most refreshing things I had seen in terms of racial dynamics in mainstream American cinema.
Training Day
Man On Fire
Pelham
American Gangster
Deja Vu
John Q
Inside Man
He Got Game
Pelican Brief (and why is it that he and Julia Roberts did not hit the sheets in this one, hmm?)
Organize for “blackness”, please. In which is DW more/less “black”.
I do believe I am the only African-American posting on this thread.
Typical.
David – I can assure you you are not.
But I will not “out” the other “African American” on this thread since I’ve never heard him mention it as if it were some sort of badge of honor or qualifier for why his opinion is more valid than everybody else’s.
Kudos to that, since it shouldn’t really matter.
All the African-Americans posting on this thread — and the other race-related threads — MUST MAKE THEIR PRESENCE KNOWN!
I’m sick of reading racist trash in here, promulgated by smug white fascist fanboys.
@ David, are you being serious?
Glemaud is from Haiti – does that count? He certainly looks “more black” than you, David.
And while we’re at it, why not the Jewish folks and gays show themselves as well!
Since we’re acting like petty children, we might as well act like small petty children.
I’m from haiti too! and i’m still waiting for david’s answer! Is he serious with that stuff?
Haiti is a beautiful country.
David, you said in my Can Colored Folks Get Some Love from Criterion too? thread that it was obviously started by a racist white troll, lol.
That, by the way—as Fredo can surely attest to—was a “calling out” of a company dedicated to bringing the finest cinema “from around the world” to step up to the plate and to expand their definition of the world.
So maybe instead of having everyone declare their ethnicity upfront, why don’t we just carefully read people’s posts?
Yes it is ,fredo. or at least it used to be
“So maybe instead of having everyone declare their ethnicity upfront, why don’t we just carefully read people’s posts.”
Now there’s a revolutionary idea. Blue K – stop being rational.
“thread that it was obviously started by a racist white troll.”
You mean, you’re not a racist white troll, Blue? lol. Actually, I think a lot of the people on this site are NOT white. But honestly, why does it matter?
Of course I’m being serious.
Is it me or this forum has derailed as of late. i’m not a constant poster but i do read it quite often. And i’m a bit taken aback by all the insults that people have been swinging at each other.I may be wrong but I truly don’t remember it being like this when i found this site back in January
@ David , And why is race relevant to the discussions we have on here?
Thanks for the shout out, Fredo.
@Blue k – I don’t know how my brain didn’t remember Rachel Getting Married, it’s one of the best examples of what my posts were about. I came up with this this last night:
I want my actors to be multiracial, but I don’t want my actors playing multiracial characters.
A little broad and vague, yes, but it’s exactly what happened in RGM. A melange of races, but not once is race brought up. They simply coincide with each other. THAT is what I want in film. To simply be.
With a name like David Ehrenstein….I tried to be witty and clevery, but it’s too early for that. You win this round, Fredo!
David, I get your frustration, believe me, but i don’t think it matters. Regardless of my skin color I am always on the side of intelligent comments.
I would like to go newspaper style here and post a retraction. Ending a drunken night on the computer is not a good idea.
@ Glemaud, I too really liked the fact that not once race is brought up in Rachel Getting Married. But I did ask myself how truly reflective of real life it was, especially since we are living in the US where people can’t seem to forget about race.
This thread is insane, lol.
@Alex Noble, lay off the sauce, lol.
“Is it me or this forum has derailed as of late”
Michel – YES!
“THAT is what I want in film. To simply be.”
Glemaud – I want the same thing, my friend.
I get the feeling some people only come on this site after they’ve been drinking.
So Alex, you are not alone!
After?
@Michel – Sure it may not be accurate, but film can be the vessel to bring us where we, as a society, need to be. I can go to a party, and no one will bring up that I’m the only black guy there. Maybe out of courtesy or just out of fear I’ll get offended and have a “AWW HELL NAWW!!” moment, but either way it’s not brought up. Do I know what they’re thinking? No, but I do know that they don’t say anything, and that’s more than enough for me. Of course, I live in LA, where it’s a little more common for situations like that arise, and I know in the Red States, things like that don’t normally happen on a regular basis.
But if more films like RGM were to arise, and more and more people see that it’s okay to just intermingle with each other, it will make for a much better society and cinematic experience later down the road.
I am of course living in a Utopian fantasy world, that I know will never come to fruition since so many of our ideals from the past still linger on today. But films like Rachel Getting Married deserve praise for doing what many others fail to do: to show a world where we can coexist and enjoy each other’s company.
Glemaud
@Alex Noble – I’ll leave the White Men Can’t Jump statement alone. Aside from that, you completely missed my point. I know that only black people could only play those roles, and only a white actor could have played someone like Harvey Milk in Milk. I’m not naive and expecting people to play genders that are historically inaccurate. But, in turn, couldn’t a black or Spanish or Asian actor play Ben Sanderson in Leaving Las Vegas? Why does Morgan Freeman have to play the “Wise Black Guy” in Shawshank Redemption?
It’s about destroying stereotypes, it’s about casting actors to be on an equal plane. Jamie Foxx shouldn’t be the first to die in Stealth.