That movie is way too long.
I agree with both of those sentiments. I really don’t like that movie, but people who have defended it have often pointed out that the dialogue gets less snarky and outlandish as the film goes on. After rewatching the film for a screenwriting class, I had to admit that that was true.
On the other hand, though, people I know who like the film have appreciated it mostly for the dialogue that it opens with. Different strokes, I suppose, although I should note that none of the people I know who like Juno, or the dialogue in it, are people who think critically about film or take it as a hobby. On a similar note, I’d be interested to hear what anyone has to say about it on here.
I think a lot of people see the dialog and the start and categorize it in the ‘Hipster file’. So, they don’t pay as much attention to the fact that she picked an adoptive family based on the hipster husband, then after he flaked out and revealed his true colors as a douche, she realized she liked the mainstream, responsible wife better. To me that’s the real message of the film.
All the hipsterisms mask the sincere emotions underlying the film, which I believe is a commentary on ‘Alternativeness’ in general. Alternativeness is a mask you wear to differentiate yourself in order to own your own identity, but it doesn’t negate the humanity behind it.
@Jirin
That’s a very interesting way to read the film, but do you think Diablo Cody actually intended for that to be the sub-textual reading of the film?
@ Brentos:
I was the most interested in Jason Bateman’s character. He played him well and I found his performance honest…..the things he was feeling, his early mid life crises…..it rang true. I don’t agree with some of the decisions he made but that’s life. In fact, all these years later his is still the character that most sticks in my mind.
I can’t stand Michael Cera as an actor…he plays himself in every movie I’ve ever seen him in….he was at his best on Arrested Development…but I blame that on the excellent writing and not on him.
I liked him in Scott Pilgrim but I agree in general.
I’m not sure what Diablo Cody intended. He probably wouldn’t describe Juno’s behavior as a ‘Mask’, but he’d probably agree with the assessment that she was originally attracted to the family because the husband was cool, but in time realized she really wanted the wife. And that’s probably also the reason the hipsterness steadily decreases throughout the film.
JIrin, have you seen the deleted scenes on the Juno dvd? Garner’s character comes off a lot more bitchy. My suspicion is that they edited out the scenes from the film that were in the script to make her more likeable.
i don’t think Juno is a hipster movie either.
@Jirin/Joks
I don’t consider the film a hipster film either, i just don’t like a lot of the dialogue, especially Juno’s. Diablo Cody is a woman btw. Her other screenplays (Jennifer’s Body and Young Adult) are very poorly written and she has been hired to write the remake of The Evil Dead—which i’m actually interested to see the female perspective on that.
@Jirin
Personally, i adored Scott Pilgrim and it’s honesty—some people are idiots, some are shitty, and some just see life the way they want to and that is real. Also, i’m just a huge fan of Edgar Wright and the graphic novels by Brian Lee O’Malley were brilliant.
@Rgrimes
Yes, Bateman’s performance was amazing and believable. his character wasn’t likable, but he was relatable (is that a word?), and he was amazing in that role.
@Joks
I haven’t seen the deleted scenes, but from your description i’m now quite interested.
Diablo Cody is a she, not a he, Jirin.
The preview turned me off this film. Actually I saw two different trailers at the cinema but after the first, the die was cast.
I mean, is ebonics spoken (badly) by two annoying non-ebony girls funny? As much as people laugh at old school expressions such as “groovy” and “swell”, at least those words were “hip” at one stage. People sound like morons RIGHT NOW when they say “fo-shizzle” (and will sound even dumber in the future). “Fo-shizzle” has NEVER sounded cool.
I believe I can rent this for free from the library but it looks like crap, plus Ellen Page is a pain in the arse. So we have Jason Bateman, but where’s Justine? Also, Diablo Cody got an Oscar for scribbling this film. If the previews represent the “best bits” of the film, heaven help it. The preview of this movie was about as funny as getting one’s genitals hacked with a weed whacker.
Let’s look at some of the earlier Best Original Screenplay winning films presented since 1970:
Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid
Patton
The Hospital
The Candidate
The Sting
Chinatown
Dog Day Afternoon
Network
Annie Hall
Coming Home
Chariots of Fire
Witness
Hannah and Her Sisters
A little later it gets muddy (around the 1990s) as Pulp Fiction won and I feel this was undeserved (although t is a somewhat entertaining film, but way overrated). This most likely paved the way for a “hip” movie like Juno to win the award. I just don’t see how Juno could match with the above movies. If it did, wouldn’t Diablo be inundated with offers to write more movies—and actually writing them and having them produced?
^Diablo Cody has been inundated with offers. She’s actually been working pretty steady since Juno, both in TV (United States of Tara) and film (Jennifer’s Body, Young Adult, plus script doctoring and she’s been working on Sweet Valley High for a while now). And of course she’s got her EW column (I believe she still has that, right?).
I think all of this attention is undeserved, though. She totally stole the Oscar from Tony Gilroy.
off-topic, but furthering Santino’s remark: I agree completely that Tony Gilroy deserved that Oscar for Michael Clayton over Juno and would argue that to the death of me, as I would that Casey Affleck deserved the best supporting oscar over Javier Bardem. Bardem’s performance was great yes, but his character was an emotionless killing machine, Affleck’s character was so intricate, believable, and tragic in The Assassination of Jesse James (whether you’re a fan of the film itself or not, Affleck’s portrayal of the role was brilliant)
Well, I wouldn’t go that far Brentos. Bardem created something iconic, something that has already become ingrained into the culture. And I would say that while his character might not be a fully fleshed out character with a deep backstory, I think it’s a great performance and very different from other roles he’s done, from The Sea Inside to Vicki Cristina Barcelona to Beatiful.
But I am sort of an Affleck hater so there you go.
ah, touche Santino. The role definitely does show the versatility of the brilliance that is Bardem. However, i felt like Affleck was born to play that role, and if he didn’t win that Oscar, he may never win one…
but i’m sort of an Oscar hater, so there’s that also lol.
and i will argue forever that Gone Baby Gone was a great film (off-topic)
///back to the topic at hand:
I was thinking about JK Simmons’ character as well, which other than Ellen Page’s and Jason Bateman’s may very well be the most fleshed out character in the film. The biggest problem i have with this script is the amount of recognition it garnered for poorly developed characters (save a few) a plot that while unique was not AMAZINGOMGZORZ!!~!~! and it’s “super awesome soundtrack and totally quotable lines”
and the line about Bucket of Blood being better than Suspiria was Diablo Cody asserting her “film knowledge/opinion” on her audience which i hate (why i can’t stand many of Tarantino’s film)
@ Brentos:
//I would that Casey Affleck deserved the best supporting oscar over Javier Bardem. Bardem’s performance was great yes, but his character was an emotionless killing machine, Affleck’s character was so intricate, believable, and tragic in The Assassination of Jesse James (whether you’re a fan of the film itself or not, Affleck’s portrayal of the role was brilliant)//
YES!!!!! Bardem found one note and stuck with it through the film…it was a great note but still…..Affleck created an emotionally complex character.
..
Perhaps I ought to rephrase:
Is Diablo Cody working on anything that I would give a shit about?
Some odd things have been nominated and/or won in recent years for Best Original Screenplay.
Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind won the award? Get out of town.
Milk won the same award a few years later? Good film but pretty overrated in some aspects.
I can’t believe that The Kids Are All Right and Inception got nominations. Okay films but far from being classics.
Not that I’ve seen any of them—and I’m not one of those snobs who says that children’s films can’t be great—but were things like Toy Story, Wall-E and The Incredibles REALLY worthy of Oscar nomination?
I guess things have been happening like this for years (Where was the Oscar nomination for the original screenplay of Robocop, in a year where Moonstruck won and Broadcast News was nominated—good films but not in the same league as Robocop in terms of sheer originality and imagination).
But I think the rot has really set in with the Oscars in this category. It just seems like it’s getting way too easy to write a screenplay and get it produced these days.
Even if Garner was more bitchy in the original screenplay, it doesn’t change that she was the one who was really excited about having a child.
@Wanderer I think that In Bruges was robbed of the Oscar from Milk
Martin McDonagh is one of the best writers of his generation (other than maybe Sebastian Barry) and while In Bruges wasn’t the best thing he’s written, it was the first feature-length film he’d written (and directed) and i found the film to be quite better than people gave it credit for.
“and i will argue forever that Gone Baby Gone was a great film”
I will agree with this. Like I said, I don’t like Casey (or Ben for that matter) but I thought he was born to play that part in Gone Baby Gone. Since I don’t think either Affleck has much range, playing someone from Boston is about as good as it’s gonna get with them.
…but were things like Toy Story, Wall-E and The Incredibles REALLY worthy of Oscar nomination?
The Oscars don’t actually matter or mean anything (except in how they advance careers…oh, wait, what is Hilary Swank doing these days?), but the answer to your question is “Yes”. All three of those movies are genius, especially The Incredibles.
The Oscars are one of those things that i rarely agree with, but i always watch, and always bitch about.
Like the Nate Berkus show or anything Gordon Ramsay does.
" what is Hilary Swank doing these days?"
A remake of Patrice Leconte’s Intimate Strangers, apparently.
Diablo Cody is going to be directing soon:
http://www.darkhorizons.com/news/22587/holly-hunter-joins-diablo-cody-comedy
I personally think the screenplay categories (both original and adapted) are better gauges of value over the best picture category. If you look over the past ten or twenty years, a lot of the best films get shut out of the best picture category but almost always show up in the writing categories.
Now who WINS is another story.
i personally very strongly dislike Diablo Cody as a human being having met her on several occasions and watched countless interviews about her. I also can’t stand Holly Hunter’s voice. She was great in O Brother Where Art Thou bc i felt like you were supposed to resent and dislike her and i already did, so the Coens did have to do much convincing for me.
But i just…loathe Diablo Cody. I try to be objective when discussing her “work” but…
that sums it up perfectly. I try to do fun things like watch movies and she pops up on random audio commentaries…ruining it with her awfulness…
I will ask, do you really think Toy Story 3 is less worthy of a best picture nomination than The Blind Side?
Childrens’ cinema is the only part of mainstream cinema that still really works hard on their script.
Toy Story 3 was superior to The Blind Side in every way…except i think that Toy Story 3 was a little bit deeper, more intellectually emotional and philosophical. so the Blind Side weighed out with public opinion and appeal. Who wants to see a film about the hardships of growing up and leaving the things you love most behind when we can watch a movie about football and poor black people getting treated good by right white people??!
Yes…a children’s movie was smarter than Remember the Titans, i mean Brian’s Song. Wait…which underprivileged black football player first shunned then loved by white people movie are we talking about again?
Speaking of screenplay Oscars, the Hollywood Reporter handicaps both categories:
Brentos
While the overall plot i think is fun and makes for a good film, the dialogue is horrendous. However, as easy as it is to hate on this film, i’ve had plenty of friends defend it.
Also, many of the characters i feel were written without very much passion or love. I honestly find Jason Bateman’s character to be the most engaging and interesting of the whole film, while many of the other characters (Michael Cera’s, Jenifer Garner’s and JK Simmons’) were written haphazardly and without much thought or care.
I’m curious how many of you agree, or disagree with any of these statements.