WORLD CUP: 1/4 FINAL VOTING- CHINA V RUSSIA
DAYBREAK 1 – The Commissar 0
RAISE THE RED LANTERN 1 – Nine Days of one Year 0
The vote for the first pairing is quite clear, even though The Commissar was impressing as well. But DAYBREAK which I saw recently, on a DVD I got from a libary makes me hungry for more films from the Shanghai-period i the 30s.
Raise the Red Lantern 1 – Nine Days of One Year 0
Daybreak 1 The Commissar 0
Raise the Red Lantern 1 Nine Days of One Year 0
City of Life and Death 0 Mother 1
The lyricism of Daybreak has the edge over the striking b+w of Commissar. The idyllic times in the towering water lilies are up with Renoir’s Partie de Campagne.
When i first saw Raise the Red Lantern, Zhang Yimou seemed to have a great career ahead of him, but i don;‘t think he’s quite lived up to his early standards, he’s gone too much intyo grand spectacle (well, the Olympics was right up his street). Gilbert Adair in his book Flickers was rather dismissive of the film’s symmetrical compositions, but in this case i think they suit the regimentation. It’s both beautiful and moving. I was very interested to see a film by Mikhail Romm, distinguished head of film studies who oversaw Tarkovsky and many other achievers- and it’s a rare thing to have such a film on scientists. It’s competent, human as well as a serious work, but maybe the characters aren’t quite engaging enough. Still, one up for the Soviets for such a thing- v Hollywood escapism
The last pairing was close, but i think City of Life and Death might have benefited from us becoming more familiar with the main characters early on. This is a story that needed to be shown on screen, and it’s time Japan fully acknowledged the events, the failure to do is pretty shameful, but many countries gloss over their own atrocities and uncomfortable historic truths. City of Life and Death takes pains to show not all the Japanese as savages, and not all Nazis as evil stereotypes. Mother indulges in more blatant propaganda, but despite its faults i think the central character brings audience emotional engagement more successfully than some other Soviet silent polemics, and its montage is still interesting
The day we have all been waiting anxiously for – with all managers sweating it out – as these great teams now left in the AWC meet for another decisive showdown. Thanks managers for all your selections. Now, on to the voting. May the best films win.
Daybreak 0 – The Commissar 1
Too bad Daybreak wasn’t paired with Mother, as that would have been a perfect match-up of two great silent films, both about the formation of a revolutionary spirit in oppressive times. Mother has great photography and interesting framing and Daybreak has great fervor and style. Moral of Daybreak: always smile for the firing squad!
The Commissar was a revelation, with many strange permutations. It had some great scenes, especially the childbirth scene with its surreal imagery. Surely, childbirth could well be seen as pushing a large cannon up a sandy hill. It was a shame that the director had this film shelved for the most stupid of reasons (damn bureaucracies everywhere) and this film virtually disappeared for 20 years. Also, the director was prevented from ever making another film. A crying shame, as The Commissar showed a genuine cinematic talent, with its raw energy and nerve. A great discovery – thanks to Russia’s manager. I enjoyed this match-up!
Raise the Red Lantern 1 – Nine Days of One Year 0
Only the Russians could make a soap opera about physicists working in a physics lab! As an ex-physics student, I enjoyed the physics talk. What other film gives neutrons so much attention? Nine Days is no match, however, for one of Zhang’s premier achievements, where every frame breathes colour and life.
City of Life and Death 1 – Mother 0
City of Life and Death was an astonishing film in every sense. It captured the events in a sweeping panorama, where every face, every detail, every frame seemed authentic and true. A great film by a new modern master. I am so happy to have now seen this, inspite of the controvery its entry entailed on the 1/4 Finals thread. I look forward to any film from this inspired director. The human tragedy was captured in unprecedented detail. Reminded me of Schindler’s List, with its b&w photography and storyline about a good German who tries to save as many Chinese as he can from a ruthless enemy.
Your own comments on this choice would be welcomed, Myra, whenever you think appropriate.
Yes City..was a fine film and reminded me of Schindler’s List too, inevitably i suppose, the b+w increased the similarities, and some of the fighting scenes reminded of the 2 strongest sections of Saving Private Ryan, but maybe the Spielbergian footprints undermined the film’s impact a little. For some reason i found it less shocking and tearing than i ’d expected.
Mother does have in common with City a strong critique of reactionary forces, but yes, would have made an interesting pairing with Daybreak (i would have given Daybreak the vote though)
“Reminded me of Schindler’s List, with its b&w photography and storyline about a good German who tries to save as many Chinese as he can from a ruthless enemy.”
yes Joe (and Kenji) but the difference between this film and the gradually INFERIOR Schindler is basically..the director’s chair.Spielberg cannot deal with humanistic endeavors and his blatant teachings at times turn Schindler from moments of "decadent’ greatness to a soapy,old-fashioned melodrama…while i do support the advantages of Spielberg’s last decent film-making approach,City breaks the cinematic bars in that it doesn’t want to force you to sympathize with either the Chinese or the Japanese groups.
or if you want an alternative theory: Spielberg does it best with fairytales,Chuan does it best with bleak sensitivies (Mountain Patrol is the best modern “Western” for pete’s sake!) ,to each his own cinema,correct?
i’ll come back later for voting,all of the Russian choices were an incredible surprise to me!
for now,
a not so easy choice:
raise the red lantern 1 — 0 nine days of one year
Daybreak 0 – The Commissar 1
Daybreak
Redxploitation.
Biblical fall as revolutionary martyrdom.
The Commissar
The surrealistic apex of Russian Civil War cinema.
An odd beast that walks by itself.
2. Raise the Red Lantern 0 – Nine Days of One Year 1
Once again I seem to be spitting in the wind, but I preferred the Russian film. I appreciate the beauty of Raise The Red Lantern – the cinematography is stunning, but the subject matter of Nine Days of One Year appealed more to me. Being a scientist by trade I was pleasantly surprised to see a film that portrays scientists as real people rather than megalomaniacs or absent-minded fools.
3. City of Life and Death 1 – Mother 0
I’m not a fan of silent films as a rule and still find a film like Mother extremely difficult to get on board with. I realise this is probably a fault with me rather than the film but it doesn’t change my vote. I think City of Life & Death is a powerful film which addresses important events in Asian history, but I’m kind of burned out on war atrocities. I’ve become a bit inured to their shocks and tragedies. An excellent example of its kind nevertheless, and an easy decision for me in the end.
Raise the Red Lantern 1 (Zhang Yimou) – Nine Days of One Year 0 (Mikhail Romm)
Current scores:
Daybreak 2 Commissar 2
Raise the Red Lantern 6 Nine Days of One Year 1
City of Life and Death 2 Mother 1
Uh oh, looks like China may be in trouble, even sans Tarkovsky as an opponent! :(
well, you are in the lead! admittedly 2 of the 3 are very close, still quite early days….
Daybreak 1 – The Commissar 0
Raise the Red Lantern 1 – Nine Days of One Year 0
City of Life and Death 1 – Mother 0
I hate to vote against my (former) home country, but here we go:
Raise the Red Lantern 1 – Nine Days of One Year 0
Nine days of one year was an interesting discovery and turned out to be a very good film. It is interesting to look at Romm’s dialogue style as a possible influence for Tarkovsky, the cinematography is beautiful and the acting brilliant. One weakness for me was the contrast between the sharp, precise, realistic dialogue writing, like the discussion in the restaurant and Lyolya’s forced monologues and thoughts. The latter part felt annoying in a way. Nevertheless, a very good film I would recommend to anyone.
Raise the Red Lantern is my favourite Yimou, a film that blew me away when I first watched it, a brilliant portrayal of human conflicts in an enclosed, polygamous community. The film is amazingly beautiful and sad and would surely be in my Top 100, if I ever got around to compile one.
City of Life and Death 1 – Mother 0
The historical importance of Pudovkin’s adaptation of Gorkiy’s novel about the 1905 worker’s strikes exceeds the films personal and emotional appeal to me by far. It is a very important film, but not one I could see myself rewatching… Still the editing techniques and the imagery are remarkable, which truly makes Mother a landmark film in the history of cinema.
Lu Chuan’s account of the Rape of Nanjing really touched me in a way that war films rarely do. I immensely admire him for having the guts to show some humanity among the Japanese (something that he even received a death threat for, I heard). There are only two scenes I had a problem with, due to exaggerated melodrama, the first one being the mass shooting scene, when the victims start yelling ‘Hail China’ and overly dramatic music starts to play. The second is the scene in the church where the Chinese women raise their hands to show who will leave to the Japanese camp. But apart from these two scenes, Lu is able to restrain from melodrama that is often innate to the portrayal of war crimes in film. City of Life and Death is a great (anti-war) film and one of my favourite films of 2009.
Daybreak (Sun Yu) 1 – The Commissar (Aleksandr Askoldov) 0
I think we could all agree Daybreak is emotional filmmaking. For me though it’s full of brilliant cinematography and disturbing juxtapositions- “propaganda” that affects me more each time I see it. In contrast the brilliant technique on display in Russia’s film seems showy and entirely at odds, in a unique but ultimately unenlightening way, with the directness demanded by the subject (both the no-bullshit title character and the too-ignored role of women in the revolution). Daybreak is one of my favorite films ever.
Raise the Red Lantern (Zhang Yimou) 1 – Nine Days of One Year (Mikhail Romm) 0
I love ’90s Zhang & Gong but I found the Russian film interesting too.
I’m not one of those boycotting the last selection on moral grounds- on moral grounds, whoever uploaded Lu’s film (and it wasn’t Team China) is doing more good than harm in exposing more people to the events of the Nanking Massacre. Unfortunately I’ve tried rewatching both films and this hasn’t changed my inability to decide.
Interesting point you make, Fandorin-San, about Romm and Tarkovsky- i was thinking of including it in my Tarkovsky (influences) list if it was on auteurs.
Raise the Red Lantern 1 Nine Days in One Year 0
I planned to watch the rest of the films in this match but unfortunately, there’s school, work and my time for other movies. I guess, a one week interval wasn’t enough, huh?
Being someone who finds science uninteresting and who is personally not good at it, I couldn’t get myself any more enthusiastic for Nine Days in One Year. I think I am more comfortable with scientist stereotypes like the mad scientists (a la Boris Karloff) and the evil ones who will do everything for the sake of science even if it means risking other people’s lives (eg. the one in The Thing from Another World). I’m sadistic like that. And maybe, I do prefer Hollywood escapism over something like this, so what?
Raise the Red Lantern is surely better than Red Sorghum but still not quite on par with something like Ju Dou (so far, my most favorite Yimou film). Although I do hate how the women try so hard to get the attention of their pig-like husband despite being not satisfied with their situations and the circumstances, melodrama wins over geeky scientists. And why does Zhang Yimou always have to be such a cynic? :( I’m all rainbow and butterflies compared to him.
Yes, especially the restaurant scene I mentioned struck as me as something Tarkvosky could have done (and reminded me of Andrey Rublev in a way).
Also, I bet this film was a major inspiration to Aleksey German Jr.’s recent, great film “Paper Soldier”.
oh i’ve not seen that, but German (snr)’s My Friend Ivan Lapshin is marvellous
Yes it is!! As is his war film “Trial on the Roads”. You really should see it, if you get the chance. I also wanted to see “Khrustalev, the car!” for quite a while, but it just doesn’t seem to happen.
updated scores:
Daybreak 4 Commissar 2
Raise the Red Lantern 10 Nine Days of One Year 1
City of Life and Death 4 Mother 1
Daybreak (Sun Yu) 0 – The Commissar (Aleksandr Askoldov) 1
Raise the Red Lantern (Zhang Yimou) 1 – Nine Days of One Year (Mikhail Romm) 0
City of Life and Death (Lu Chuan) 0 – Mother (Vsevolod Pudovkin) 1
Yabloko ot yabloni nedaleko padayet
Daybreak (Sun Yu) 1 – The Commissar (Aleksandr Askoldov) 0
Given that Daybreak is a much older film, The Commisar looks more technically and visually polished. And the Russian film definitely has its fine moments, but I think that it suffers a bit from a lack of focus, whereas the Chinese selection is overall a more consistent and emotionally compelling film.
City of Life and Death (Lu Chuan) 0 – Mother (Vsevolod Pudovkin) 1
Sometimes a film comes along that must be watched by as many people as possible because its lessons to humanity outweigh whatever merits it may have simply as a film. And City of Life and Death is one of those films, that documents in unflinching detail an atrocity which too many in the West are unaware of and which too many in Japan still deny. Of the few films that have been made about the Rape of Nanjing, this is the best. Unfortunately, I am not completely sold on the more Hollywood epic style of filmmaking the director employed—even though this is clearly a far superior film to something like Schindler’s List. On the other hand, Pudovkin’s Mother is quite a special film, one that I’ve always found myself drawn to as it focuses more on individuals than Eisenstein’s films.
So the two silent films triumph. I’ll be back to cast a final vote after I watch Nine Days of One Year.
Daybreak (Sun Yu) 1 – The Commissar (Aleksandr Askoldov)
“The Commissar” has an unusual premise, but ultimately becomes an interesting statement on how families are affected by war. The scene in which the female commisar states that she wished the death of her child as well as the latter one where kids play soldiers and “violate” one of the girls are great allegories on the perversion of human insticts through political ideologies and sociological disorder. It´s nevertheless appearant that other Russian films like “Come and See” managed to demonstrate these points in a much more blatant way than “The Commisar” which only hints at some important issues, but doesn´t delve into these. The Chinese silent film “Daybreak” is a brilliant depiction of the fatal consequences of urbanization, and manages to keep a fine balance between the illustrating social injustice and scenes of harmonic beauty. The victimization of the female main character which seems typical for Chinese films from that period is band together with a political message that appears less propagandistic than in “Little Toys”, my only previous encounter with Sun Yu, culminating in a strong final statement on injustice.
Raise the Red Lantern (Zhang Yimou) 1 – Nine Days of One Year (Mikhail Romm)
It has been a pleasure to see a little known film by Tarkovsky´s teacher Mikhail Romm, and I can also see some parallels in regards to the dialogues as pointed out before. The acting performances – one of the leads being “Hamlet” from Kozintsev´s adaptation that was selected by Caucasus/Ukraine in the 1/8 finals – are excellent, but I have to agree with Fandorin-San on the artificiality of the woman´s interior monologues which I don´t think were necessary at all. The interior shots of the scientific laboratory are great with a sometimes Welles-ian use of depth-of-field, but some overly expressionistic shot scenes make the film´s style appear uneven at times. I think that it´s a great but flawed film, which doesn´t compare the the almost flawless “Raise the Red Lantern”, a stunningly beautiful and daring film about a paradoxical social arrangement that caused jealousy and hostility between wives and concubines, and can be considered as an unnecessary torture Chinese women had to endure until Mao established a divorce law and replaced the ancient torture with a more absurd political one that even made children turn against their parents. It´s evident that Zhang Yimou was able to attack the old system more bluntly than he was able to do with the Cultural Revolution in “To Live”, and “Raise the Red Lantern” stands out as one of his greatest works due to its straightforwarness.
Mother 0 – City of Life and Death 0
My fascination for “City of Life and Death” made me use this opportunity to rewatch the film once again instead of taking the time to watch its contender for which I didn´t feel in the mood, but I have to point out that Lu Chuan´s films is one of the greatest depictions of war and destruction that I have seen so far. The compassionate and helpless Japanese soldier who shares the viewer´s perspective makes us realize the inhumanity people are capable of whenever indiscriminate killing is admissible, and the sadistic tendencies that usually lie quiet in human beings emerge. The final desperation in the face of untamed drive which turns man into a an untisocial beast which leads to the desperation and suicide of the individual whose moral education proves strong enough to domineer over these tendencies is a tragic swan song on mankind´s ability to resist destruction, and make this one of the most relevant films I have seen in recent years.
Daybreak 1– The Commissar 0
Raise the Red Lantern 1 – Nine Days of One Year 0
While I generally don’t respond well to overt propaganda, Daybreak won me over due to its handling of the characters involved and their emotional responses, as well as in finding a style where the melodrama of the characters situations fits comfortably within the larger political dramatics. There is a glorious excess in all of this that I find quite appealing, especially since the film seems concerned with the characters first, and the politics second. One of my issues with some of the Soviet films, even films as great as Earth, is that the characters don’t really live on their own but act as symbols or tokens for the political message. The individual is consumed by the state and is nothing more than a blood cell in the body politic. While that is certainly closer to the aim of communist propaganda, to convince people that this is a good thing, it inevitably pushes me away rather than enticing me. Daybreak then, in a sense, subverts its own message by the strong identification with the main character and by the vivid individuality of the characters that surround her even when they act as examples supporting the political philosophy of the times. Which makes the situations depicted seem less a universal condemnation of an ideology than it is specific individuals responding to to the events of their times which may or may not be experienced by the viewer.
The Commissar never really worked for me. I appreciate the skill shown by those involved, but I was never drawn into its world. That may be my failing or that of the film, I’m not sure which, but either way I can’t vote for it.
The Red Lantern vs Nine Days match was a very close one for me. Nine Days was more interesting and intriguing and every bit as attract as Red Lantern, but Lantern was involving and compelling on an emotional level that Nine Days couldn’t match.
I didn’t get a chance to see City of Life and Death, so no vote in the last pair. Mother pretty much fits in to what I described above and while I admire its virtuosity, its stridency was too much for me.
Daybreak 1 The Commissar
Raise the Red Lantern 1 Nine Days of One Year
City of Life and Death 1 Mother
The Russian films I hadn’t seen were good discoveries, but not on a par with the discovery of City of Life and Death, which just shook me. Thank heavens this is coming to cinemas in the UK and I can see it on the big screen.
current scores:
Daybreak 8 The Commissar 3
Raise the Red Lantern 14 Nine Days of One Year 1
City of Life and Death 5 Mother 3
a pity Nine Days of One Year is being thrashed, by one of China’s very best, as it certainly deserves respect.
at the moment votes:
Tianming 1 – Komissar 0
Vavilova’s epic tragedy is impressive but until it grows more on me,Lili’s stupendous grandeur is too depressing to go unnoticed.
Dà Hóng Dēnglóng Gāogāo Guà 0 – Devyat Dney Odnogo Goda 1
another wonderful (and perfect indeed) feminine touch through the eyes of a mistress but even Gong Li isn’t enough for now to make me ignore the all-star class of the cast,even if they’re playing dead-pan scientists.
Nánjīng! Nánjīng! 0 – Mat 1
i have shown my love for that dreadful depiction of the Nanjing massacre in plenty a-threads but this is one of the few times i’ll go by old-timing preference and not even political ideologies will prevent me from taking sides sociologically speaking.
i won’t say a thing here other than i was extremely pleased to have seen the 2 brand-new discoveries from the Russian part and a new masterpiece of the silent era from the Chinese side,bravo!
apursansar
THE AUTEURS WORLD CUP 2009 : 1/4 FINAL VOTING
We are now starting the 1/4 final matches. New participants are still most welcome and allowed to vote in the following match-ups.
On this thread, voting will be on match A, China v Russia. The other match between Japan and Italy will be on another thread.
The extended voting period for this match lasts from 7 pm GTM on Thursday 3rd December until 6 pm GMT on Friday 4th December, which means that users will have 23 hours in order to publish their votes. The world map which lists all current time zones can be found on www.worldtimezone.com, so that everyone can be up to date about how much time is left.
After the voting period is over the votes will be counted and the results published. We will then be having a one hour break, before the next two matches start, and a viewing break for the next round after the 1/4 final matches are over.
The special world cup section is still to be updated, the current line-ups and previous 1/8 final films provided by The Auteurs staff can be found on: http://www.theauteurs.com/worldcup2009
Each user can vote on any line-up of each match as long as he/she has watched both films that are lined-up against each other. An explanation for the preference in each case would be greatly appreciated, as provided by most voters in the previous matches. You can vote on any single pairing; you do not have to vote on all 3 pairings of a match. Team managers are not allowed to vote on matches their own team participates in. The voting should be handled like this:
Film A 1 (or 0) – Film B 0 (or 1)
Film C 0 (or 1) – Film D 1 (or 0)
Film E 1 (or 0) – Film F 0 (or 1)
Please mark the winning film/score in large or heavy print. You can give your explanatory statements either after each vote or after all 3 votes.
The match you´re going to vote for on this thread is
CHINA V RUSSIA
Daybreak (Sun Yu) – The Commissar (Aleksandr Askoldov)
Raise the Red Lantern (Zhang Yimou) – Nine Days of One Year (Mikhail Romm)
City of Life and Death (Lu Chuan) – Mother (Vsevolod Pudovkin)